When the guy asks the girl's dad for her hand in marriage.
Now, don't get me wrong, this tradition is fine for others. I'm not criticizing other couples for having done it this way. However, I will not be having it.
First off, if I'm gonna spend the rest of my life with a guy, that's my decision and my decision alone (I get it that the asking of the dad is in addition to, not instead of asking the woman, but still). I know a lot of girls who have said they will be very upset if the guy does not ask her father. They feel it's tradition and it's cute and charming and will make the whole family happy. Fine for them. Not for me.
Second - the Jessie Spano in me does feel there's a slightly sexist component to this tradition. I don't know for sure, but I'm guessing this originated in a place where dowries were the thing and a man's wife was considered his 'property'. Why the father? Why not both the parents?! What is the old-fasioned thought at the base of this? One man has owned me thus far, now another man is asking to take me over, in a business-like transaction (in the same way one would buy or sell of a piece of a company to another)?
Perhaps a man sitting down both my parents asking them for my hand in marriage is a little more settling to me, but still, I am not a minor. It is my decision to make and their vote in the matter, is, in theory, moot point. Sure, if my parents really didn't want the guy I was dating in our family, it might affect my opinion, but if I had my heart set on him, it would not.
Anyhow. I know there's a lot of room for debate on a lot of these points and that some people just see this as cute/traditional/harmless. And, I suppose, it is all in the eye of the beholder. However, for me personally, as I said earlier - I will not be having it. If a guy were to ask my father, it would be an automatic no on my end. It would show to me that this guy doesn't really know me. It would also say that he cares more about following some soceital tradition than making me happy, which is a red flag to anyone. Actually, it would pretty much say he doesn't care about flat out pissing me off at a moment when he is supposed to be going out of his way to charm me and win me over.
However, as I said earlier, I know several girls who will be very upset/disappointed if their guy does not ask his future father-in-law's permission. Your thoughts? Does anyone else feel the same way I do on this tradition? Are there any other Jessie Spanos out there?
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7 comments:
I disagree. I like being viewed as property. Transactions are fun. I would be dissappointed if my dad wasn't involved, only because I know how happy it would make him that he was thought of in the process. Also, he'll be paying for the majority of the wedding (if that tradition still carries on in 10 years) so having my soon-to-be fiance ask him a simple, yet extremely important question is the LEAST we could do.
p.s. that ring is GORGEOUS!!
Aside: I have no cultural reference point for Saved by the Bell. I can barely remember who the main characters were, and I don't know the plot points of any episodes. You reference it (and Jessie Spano) a lot. It makes me feel weird and not cool and out of the loop. And yet, I am still not interested in watching it. Now, if you spoke in Simpsons terms, and said something like, "well, maybe I'm a little too Lisa Simpson...", I would get it instantly. I am pretty sure that I am the only person my age in this country who doesn't like/doesn't get SBTB. That is all.
Regardless, there is nothing slightly sexist about the tradition. It is sexist, and yes, it is based on the idea that women are property and negotiations need to be made to get her married off.
I don't like things done in the name of tradition. However, I think the idea of the guy talking to both of the girls' parents and telling them that he would like to marry their daughter (not necessarily asking their permission) is kind of nice. It shows respect and consideration for the parents. And who most likely will be paying for the wedding, although this is not the case for a whole lot of weddings. I agree that it is the woman's decision-and should only be her decision. Regardless, it is definitely not a requirement for me.
Also, I plan on not having bouquets, garters, a first dance, a dad dance, or any of that other traditional junk at my (some time in the distant future.) It's just not my thing.
Jaime, I think you're missing the boat on this one. I did too before I was married on things like this.
The reason? A marriage isn't merely between two people, it's between two families.
When you marry someone, you aren't just choosing a lifetime buddy. You're choosing to become part of that person's family and welcoming that person into your family.
Asking a woman's father and/or mother for her hand in marriage is important if for no other reason than too many boyfriends don't actually sit down and have a serious conversation with the two people who spent the first 18+ years raising their future spouse. You're going to likely be having half of your family holidays with these people. You may need to chose their nursing home in 30 years. In the worst of times, humbly ask for money after you both lose your jobs and can't pay the mortgage.
Furthermore, I think that asking the woman's parents for permission and taking the time to think through the pitch, or at the very least why you want to spend your whole life with this gal is a good exercise in reflection to the relationship. If you can't articulate why exactly you want to marry this woman and what you're going to bring to the table in terms of responsibility, then I question if you're making the choice at the right time.
I'd also note that the woman isn't exactly the sole decision maker in this process. If the father is expecting to be asked for permission and you don't ask because you're trying to be a non-traditional rebel, you can start your married relationship with your in-laws off poorly for no good reason. Worse yet, you could potentially have the woman's father decide show his non-traditional side and offer no assistance with the wedding expenses. Not a wise move!
Matt
Matt. Interesting commentary.
Ok - so i do agree with/like the idea of the man sitting down with the girls' parents and getting better acquainted with them, because, as you said - they spent the first 18 years helping shape this person, for better or for worse.
However, I am still up in arms about the 'asking permission' part. That, and, conversely, does this girl have a sit-down with her future husband's parents as well? Does she ask them permission to accept their son's proposal?
That, and I disagree with the idea of the woman not being the sole decision maker in the process. I think, in theory, she is. Although I do agree that one doesn't just marry a person, he/she marries a family - the woman (and man) in the serious relationship are adults of their own free will shaping their own adult lives, which is sometimes independent of what the parents might want for them. I do agree that the father might be po'ed and not want to pay for the wedding - however, that is the wedding, not the marriage - and I think we can all agree which is more important.
Anyhow - in short - how I see it is that, yes, sitting down with and getting to know and make good with the future inlaws is definitely important, I'm still not feeling the 'I'd like your daughter's hand in marriage' aspect of things.
Oh - and yes - this is my dream ring. Gorge!
I'd be scared if the first time that my future husband sat down for a serious talk with my parents was for the 'proposal talk.' I would hope that both my future husband and I would have developed strong relationships with each other's families prior to getting married.
I am not sure why a woman wouldn't be expected to do the same thing with her future husband's parents. Isn't marriage an equal partnership? Why wouldn't the same hoping to get married?
If my dad refused to help pay for my wedding because of something as insignificant as 'permission', then I'd elope. But luckily, my dad (or my mom for that matter) doesn't see me as property to be given away.
I'm with you. My dad's not the one living with my future husband. I am. So I'm all that matters!
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